British-Cars.org

Welcome to the DMR Site for British Car Information.

Recommendations

Parts

MG parts spares and accessories are available for MG T Series (TA, MG TB, MG TC, MG TD, MG TF), Magnette, MGA, Twin cam, MGB, MGBGT, MGC, MGC GT, MG Midget, Sprite and other MG models from British car spares company LBCarCo.

MG TD TF 1500 - Flex oil line failure! Check yours today!

On a final fall drive yesterday a major disaster was narrowly avoided - I hope! A connection between a flex oil line and oil pump banjo failed and my entire sump of oil was pumped overboard in a matter of seconds! Based on the oil slick in the road for about 1/4 mile prior, this happened just as I was reaching my destination. Had the car towed home today. Can't assess the engine damage, if any, until new line & oil installed. Wish me luck! Hopefully I caught it in time.

This happened using a spin on filter assembly provided by a 3rd party vendor (not Moss). In all fairness to the vendor I'll await his response before posting results here. I'm hoping he may have an alternate solution. I just wanted to caution anyone out there of a potential danger. I would caution anyone to lift the bonnet and give any such connections a good pull before starting up again! This connection was installed new 4 years ago but has had less than 1,000 miles since that time (due to total restoration).

Ed


efh Haskell

That sucks Ed. If you have a hydraulic shop in Gunnison they can most likely crimp a new hose on your ends. NAPA can do it here in town or a few other places.
LaVerne

Yikes, that is too bad. Obviously a defective line. l Wierd fitting- don't see how that could crimp very much on the flex. Nothing to do with the spin-on adaptor? Did you hear any rattling or knocking? When you get it going, if all sounds fine and great oil pressure you may have dodged disaster. Or you may want to pull the pan and make sure the rod bearings weren't hammered. Maybe back to the original pipes too- I have run my original pipes with a spin-on adaptor for many years. George
George Butz

I have a number of original brass lines if you want to go back to stock and have a little more piece of mind.
Bruce Cunha

Ed, did this line come from someone in CA?
Tom Maine (TD8105)

I have the exact same lines Ed, but have not yet rebuilt my engine or installed them. This makes me worry now, the reason I bought them was to prevent a leak. The lines were not that cheap either. Let us know your solution.

Rich

Richard Taylor TD3983

I got a quick response from the vendor today. He has offered a new set of lines at no charge with a current production run. He has also contacted others who got the same run. He is going to send mine to the producer to be tested to see what happened.

George, I agree about the crimp on the flex! Makes me worry even more:<

Bruce, your offer is appreciated. Do you happen to know the Moss number of your filter assembly? I had one of the early ones they don't make filters for anymore (even though Moss has been promising them for years). I tried the blue Moss spin on 4 years ago but it leaked like a sieve. Moss refunded that one. That is why I purchased this unit and it has worked fine for about 1000 miles till yesterday. My old one had brass pipes but one was cracked and "mended" by PO. I'm wondering if your pipes would fit to my new filter without bending? But if bent they would surly crack? What do you think?

Tom, yes they came from CA.
efh Haskell

What a bummer, Ed.I sure hope that no damage was done internally. I know exactly what you are going through right now as I had a whole lot of apprehension as I pulled my head off last Saturday. Dave Headley has finished cleaning up the head and is going to mill .075 off it to increase the compression ratio a bit. I'll get it back together in December when I get back to Colorado. Hopefully you will be up and running soon and ready for a get together in Telluride in the spring.
A. R. Todd

If you want to make her a real mountain climber Art, then have Dave just skim what's needed and put a blower on it. Really makes em so much more pleasureable to drive in our area.
LaVerne

While you are checking those lines, be sure to check the rubber line going to your oil pressure gauge...think it is just a short connection. I lost mine the first day out and my 6 quarts was a 5 mile 1/2" line that i was able to follow home...

By the way...didn't do a bit of damage as I noticed the oil pressure fall to zero just as i was finishing my run....and shut it down....flatbedded home....
gblawson(gordon- TD27667)

I bought my set of oil lines from CA. several years ago and have no problem with them at all. I have had the solid ones bust due to vibration and that is why I went to the vendor for these. I also have the Phil Marino oil filter holder on my car which is a lot better than the original and cuts down on the vibrations. This to was put on after the old holder failed.
Tom Maine (TD8105)

The end of the fitting on the oil line from the block to the head leaked on my engine right after my GOF trip. The original line was rubber with a wire wound around it... the new line was braided flex from Moss. Kelvin Dodd said they had not received reports regarding the line, but I'm running a spare from Abingdon Spares that I had in my spares box. It is a rubber line with a wire wound around it, albeit a slightly larger diameter than the one that was on there when I restored the car.

Chances are your engine is fine, Ed. You could go quite a ways without oil before you started having a problem. In fact, two quarts are all that are needed to lubricate the engine in the event you loose all your oil, repair the problem and have to drive to the next town.

warmly,
dave
Dave Braun

If you shut it down soon enough there should be no problem, I ran mine for a while with no oil when the seal on the filter blew, once when the pipe broke and once when the pressure dropped due to a malfunction in the line. neither time was the engine hurt. Just scares hell out of ya..
Tom Maine (TD8105)

Ed

Unsure what unit you have, can you post a picture? My TD is an early one with the separate oil filter. I blew up my first engine and that is why I have the spares. I run a spin on system and have never had any issues with leaks or problems with the original pipes.

Of note. Even though the two engines I have were only a few thousand numbers apart, the oil pipes are a different configuration. Not sure why that is. The two sets are interchangeable for length, but the bends are different.
Bruce Cunha

Ed,

Thanks for posting this! Bud Krueger brought it to my attention.

I have the exact same as in the picture - two sets (one on TD, another on TC) that's 8 connections to check - and as Richard said above ... not cheap, $125 per set!

I bought them in October 2006 but no longer have the contact or ordering information. I would like to contact the seller in CA.

Might you please send me an email with his contact information?

Thank you,

Paul
Paul Hinchcliffe

I lost all my contacts a while back but it is John Seim in Ca. Perhaps someone has his e mail
Tom Maine (TD8105)

Paul & Tom, if you want to email me at efhask at roadrunner dot com I can help you. Paul, if you could also send me a shot or 2 of your hoses as installed in the TD I would appreciate it. There is some leway in the process and perhaps we could help each other out here.

Current status is I received and installed the new set of lines, added oil, started right up. Oil pressure fine, took a short test drive, engine seems ok (whew!). Old lines are being sent to the manufacturer for analysis. I hope they really take care and tell me exactly what caused this to happen. Reportedly they make such hoses for Mack trucks and others. Almost lost my engine!

Ed
efh Haskell

Ed, I know of several instances where oil pressure was lost due to some catastophic failure of either the lines ( old S pipes) or the filter blew off and in all of them, no damage to the engine as long as you got it shut down right away. Hopefully, you will enjoy many more runs in the car.
Tom Maine (TD8105)

I have the same hoses on my car and know the seller well. He has sold countless sets to replace old crack-prone original pipes, so I'm sure this was an unfortunate fluke. Still, I feel an irresistible urge to go check mine for leaks!

In a pinch, any good hydraulic shop can re-crimp a hose like this for you. In fact I have most of my hoses made by a well respected local shop rather than buy them from the usual suppliers. I will do the same when these oil lines eventually need replacing.
Steve S

No hydraulic shops near me...such is life in the mountains.
efh Haskell

Ed, glad the engine is OK.

My son-in-law had one split on his Chevy S-10 pick-up and cost him an engine. His split open right at the "Made in Mexico" printing and was two years old.

Bill
Bill Brown

Just a quick question, does Synthetic oil have any benefit to save an engine with a loss of oil pressure such as this?

thanks,
Bill
Bill Brown

Ed, if you find yourself in need then send me whatever hoses you need repaired and I'll take care of it.
Steve S

Thanks for the offer Steve. Appreciate it.
efh Haskell

I'm no expert Ed, but I find it curious that the crimp marks run in paralell to the hose instead of 90 degrees as I would have expected.
LaVerne

Who knows LaVerne? Oddly, the original hoses had parallel crimp marks plus a row of what I would call "dimples" half way up that ran the other direction. The new ones I just got do not have the latter. Looks like a different crimping machine was used on the new ones? The old ones are on the way to the mfg. as we speak. Hope they are honest so I know if this thing is safe or not! Big investment at stake!!
efh Haskell

Ed, would you post a pic of the new ends?

Thanks,
Rich
Richard Taylor TD3983

Rich,
Here ya go. Top hose is the failed one with the "dimples". Bottom one just came last week. I'm no expert but it just occured to me looking at this that there is a raised ring ("boss"?) on the banjo end that gets covered with the crimped fitting. Maybe there is supposed to be some sort of locking ring or something that fits inside this area? If so, mine had none. What else would this ring be for? Just a guess. Anybody with experience out there?
Ed


efh Haskell

Thanks Ed,
It looks like the one on the top has more sealing surface but it could just be the pic. I am not sure what you mean by the raised boss but the dimpled one is exactly like the set I have.
I may take them to a local hydraulic shop and see if they can put a little extra umph on them.

Thanks,
Rich
Richard Taylor TD3983

Rich, you might want to put them in a vice and give a good tug. Please let us know what happens if you try! The "boss" (not sure if this is correct term) is that raised ring right before the "barbs" start on the stem of the banjo. On bottom hose it is hidden by the crimped fitting.
efh Haskell

This thread was discussed between 19/10/2011 and 02/11/2011

MG TD TF 1500 index

This thread is from the archives. Join this live forum now