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MG Midget and Sprite General - The value of Midgets vs MGBs

Hi Ladies and Gents,

Not really posted in a while, hope you are all enjoying the festive period. There has been some nice mild weather for driving/working on your broken car in my case!

Out in the garage today I was wondering... Why is it that Midgets genreally cost less than MG Bs? Looking in the back of Safety Fast a top, fully restored B can go for around 15k, a top Midget I expect would go for half that maybe.

It seems odd to me when the B is a lot more common and doesn't really offer a speed, fun, style/looks, comfort or practicality advantage.

It doesn't make sense to my logical mind! Does Anybody have any ideas or theories? I am interested as to what people think.

Thanks all,
Malcolm
Malcolm Le Chevalier

Half the price - half the size!!!!
dave
Dave Price

Malcolm,

As I recall, here in the States anyway, one of the biggest problems (IMHO) was image, and status. In the 1960's and 1970's horse power was king, and petrol was, and still is cheap (relatively speaking) here. The Sprite and Midget were (and perhaps still are) viewed as inexpensive learner cars for beginners, and always treated as such. For those in the know, they were and still are, great for short distances for sporty transport. The MGB, the obverse.

Regards,

Larry C.
Larry C '69 Midget

When the MGB was new it cost more than a Midget and they built a lot more MGBs than Midgets as well so the demand for the MGB over the Midget was there even when new.

For some, the epitome of a British sports car is an MGB for some reason. Being a slightly larger car, they have more space in them for occupants/carrying capacity than our Midgets do.

It has also been bantered about that the MGB was considered a "man's car" and the Midget was a "girl's car". Don't know about that statement being even true, but I know the Midget is a lot more fun to drive than an MGB, it is also certainly much rarer than an MGB too. Last year at British Car Day here, there was hundreds of MGBs of all years, only 20 Midgets of all years on the field.

I would think the value of a Midget should be more than an MGB but it isn't although values for good, unmolested cars is rising, one will never be able to pay off the mortgage by selling a Midget.

My Midget was purchased by chance. With the numerical odds of MGB versus Midget it rightly should have been an MGB but I'm more than pleased it was the other way around. I love going places with my little car and being the only representative of my car's nameplate among the many MGBs.

Anyone can have an MGB, it takes time to find a Midget!

Clive Reddin

It's an interesting topic....

Sprites and Midgets here in Aus are closer in value to the B's but in my mind are a far more desirable car.

Larry I think hits the nail on the head... It's status and the Spridget was (and I guess always will be) the poor relation. It value is therefor reflected in that.

Over my many years of driving, I have been fortunate enough to own and drive many cars, some of them VERY nice indeed. I may be tempted to own an Ex Dick Protherow E Type, or another 'Baby' Elan, but I can honestly say there aren't many cars out there that give so much in the way of driving pleasure.

But Shhhh.... Don't tell everyone or they'll all want one and the value of our humble little cars will extend beyond our pockets... :-(

Be happy that for a small investment we can still enjoy a pleasure that others may snub in their MGBs, TRs etc.

Mark.
M T Boldry

""It seems odd to me when the B is a lot more common and doesn't really offer a speed, fun, style/looks, comfort or practicality advantage.""

Not sure I agree with that Malcolm but you are entitled to your opinion.

The MGB is a far more substantial car than the Midget and as stated was a lot more expensive to produce.

I love the MGB and of course the Spridget as well. However I also love the MGA, MGF etc, just an Abingdon nutter I suppose!

Regarding value and rarity I o not think rarity adds to the value of any item per se, many factors come into play.

I am afraid the vast majority of people who buy an MG can only ever think of the MGB and so many change hands, ask joe soap in the steet if he knows an MG and he will never say Midget but will always say MGB.
Robert (Bob) Midget Turbo

I've had both MGBs and Midgets and I can say that the Midget is much more fun to drive, and easier to drive too. By comparison the MGB feels like a truck with its heavy steering and rolling handling. But if you've got 400 miles to drive, the MGB is much nicer. It is less stressed and there is more passenger and luggage space. Horses for courses I guess.

I've just acquired a baby Elan Sprint to rebuild. I've not had one of these before but I'm hoping I will like it as much as the Midget. It's certainly worth an awful lot more!
Mike Howlett

Now lets get in a few peoples hair

Alot of people like the looks of a B better.
A B with overdrive is a lot more substantial car on the motorway.
Boot of a B is bigger.
Syncho on 1st is a plus for most.

But they are not half as fun as a midget.
With the exeption of the early pullhandle cars who drive a lot nicer
Onno K

I don't think I'd ever consider owning a 4 cylinder B. To me they're boring, and they hold the least appeal to me of any MG (on the other hand, one day I WILL own an MGA, and a C, TC, and Magnette are high on my personal list too). But as most people have said, they are the iconic british sports car to many people, and often the only MG they know. I find the same thing surprising (in terms of values) as it doesn't reflect my opinion at all. But I won't complain! Now if only MGA values would drop a little too...
Andrew F

I love my IoW Frog and my MG BGT, I think I have the best of both Worlds with space, comfort and a roof with the GT and Frog for fun !! (must admitt I dont get the MG B)
K Harris

I've got a mate who's wanted a B roadster for years, but hasn't bought one, because when he was younger and even now, they were called hairdressers cars.

When I was younger, apart from frogeyes, spridgets were not much more than a joke. I personally wanted a spitfire, and was going to stick in a GT6 lump.

I too bought my Sprite by chance when the spitfire I was after was sold before I could get the 40 quid together. 35 years later, I've ignored all the negative comments about the Sprite, because as everybody who owns one (pre 1500) agrees, they are great to drive. (I don't like the 1500 unless it's made to look like a 1275).

The Spridget was a cheap and chearful entry level "sports" car. Just because people modify them doesn't justfiy them being worth more imo.

As for value. If the B had handled better without modification, you couldn't criticise it much. But it's a bigger car and actually I like them. They are perceived, reasonably I think, as a more substantial and comfortable car.

The biggest image problem the Spridget had, and still has, imo, was the stupid name.

Big or more powerful was always perceived as better, and if you had to give a name to a car that would have the piss taken out of it, you couldn't have come up with a better name than "Midget". Midgets aren't big, and they aren't powerful, and they aint sexy.

They should have stuck to the one mark. AH Sprite. Not big or powerful either, but a bit more subtle, and they had the "imp" factor. :).
Lawrence Slater

Thanks gents, interesting comments. As I'm not of the B/Midget generation originally I don't really know what peoples perceptions of the cars were originally, I suppose this has a lot to do with it as its predominantly older folk that buy such cars.

All my 20 something friends just think owning an old 2 seater is cool. They wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a B, Midget or even Spitfire!

and finally when I said Bs dont really offer a comfort or practicality advantage, I meant in comparison to a modern car, thinking that Bs and Midgets are both fun weekend cars and practicallity isn't all that important and neither car is great compared to a modern car.

Cheers all, off to go get filthy again, wonder if I can get my sodding cotter pin out!

Malcolm
Malcolm Le Chevalier

<<With the exeption of the early pullhandle cars who drive a lot nicer >>

...but don't have synchro on first gear ;o)

Having owned both, I can definitely agree that the Spridget is more fun to drive. The B is more of a tourer. Spridgets are also a lot easier to work on IMO.
Dave O'Neill2

Jep
But I have never missed the synchro and am amazed every time I drive an original (3 bearing 3 syncro) pullhandle.

Malcom try driving 700 miles in a day in an un modified

-Modern
-BGT
-B
-Midget

You will find big comfort differences between each.
The smallest one wil be between the GT and the modern.
Onno K

>> The B is more of a tourer

There's a clue in the factory name for the MGB soft-top: "MGB Tourer". MG knew what they were making, and named it accordingly.

A
Anthony Cutler

people follow a fashion and it becomes self perpetuating

like almost all classics Bs and Spridgets are overpriced old cars

I remember when a show class B would be valued at £10,000 and a less popular classic car of exactly the same standard of quality would be valued at a tenth of that - in this case a Mk3 Cortina, this was well before Life on Mars TV series

Mk2 Jags very popular and valued at twice that of the better Jag/Daimlier alternatives, this was before the Morse TV series and their value increased more after

most B owners tended to be old with disposable income to spend restoring and tarting up their cars so they keep the values up
Nigel Atkins

It took me 2 years to find an honest RWA Midget. It ticks all the boxes and always generates a look of interest from all ages when I take it to work. When I was a boy in the 60's the MGB GT was always a dream, and to be honest, I would still like a V8 now. Although, I woudn't sell the Midget, she's my pride and joy.
P Ottewell

In my country, prices for Midgets have not changed for the last five or so years, but prices for MGBs are slowly going down, so the gap is closing. Like everywhere else, it is rare to spot a Midget between the MGBs and MGAs on club events here.

If I remember correctly the price of a Midget in the sixties was about 65 % of the price for an MGB, and I feel this price ratio would be right even today.

Being fortunate enough to own a ´63 pull handle MGB with the original 3 bearing engine, I must say I think it handles quite well and is very enjoyable to drive. Not as fun as our ´61 Midget, but a lot more practical on long runs, and as has been said, more substantial. My wife appreciates that! If I had to sell one of the two, I´m sorry to say it would be the Midget - much as I love it.

I think many MGBs are spoilt by worn front suspension rubber bushes causing wrong geometry in the front suspension, by lack of steering rack lubrication, by too small steering wheels and by too low tyre pressures, particularly at the front. Equal pressure front and rear makes the car a lot better balanced on corners. My experience is that these factors are much more critical to the handling and feel of an MGB than on the much lighter Midget.

Come to think of it, when John Surtees was testing sports cars on a club circuit for Classic & Sports Car 10 years ago, he got better lap times with an unmodified pull handle MGB than with an E-type, a Triumph TR6 and an Austin Healey 100 M. So it can´t be that bad!

Tore



Tore

Onno speaks of driving 700 miles in a day in different cars. I agree absolutely with his assessment. If I had to do that journey, I would automatically go in our new VW. Failing that the V8 BGT would be the one. It is just as comfortable but the noise levels are high compared to a modern car - and it uses twice as much fuel.

Malcolm, being of the MGB/Midget generation, my perception is that the MGB was not seen as a proper sports car, and as has been said here, MG themselves called it a Tourer. It was viewed as being better than a Sunbeam Alpine, but not as manly as a TR4. The Midget was just for fun and for those who couldn't afford a "proper" car.

In a magazine article of the time the journalists pitted an MGB against a TR4 on a race track. Both cars were standard. Although the TR4 had the legs on the MGB on the straight, the B always caught up at the twisty bits, and it ended up with honours even.

In another comparison test between a 1275 Midget and a 1300 Spitfire, they stated that the Triumph was more comfortable, roomier and had overdrive, but both testers said they would take the Midget if they had to choose.
Mike Howlett

One thing no one mentioned is the cost of renovation between a be and a midget

From what ive seen in moss and other sources is new parts fo a B or an A and esp a Triumph TR6 is off the hook compared to midget renovation...

So comparing midgets to Bs... Its always going to cost more for a B

Another reason for midgets never growing in value... Is they are so small and have a limited market of owners... Yes ONCE your inside the car its comfy, but getting in and out is another moment all togather....combined with the age of the avg buyer...thats a problem to... Not to mention the expense

For the price tag and time to build of a nice cherry hot rod mg midget you can also have a decent shelby cobra kit car from the beginning kit.... Thats a tough call to make when your going to drop 20k over a 3 year period.

Prop
Prop and the Blackhole Midget

OK,

A little more insight from (USA) when they were new. Here's a bit from a 1973 Road & Track sports car test entitled "Back to Basics" in reference to "Show Room Stock" SCCA Sports Car Racing here in the USA. The Midget wasn't winning anyone's heart, at least with the Road & Track tester's for this report. But, for those who commented on the MGB's handling, take a look at some of the test times recorded for the MGB on this day.

http://www.karmannghiaconnection.com/73rt_roadtest.html

Regards,

Larry C.
Larry C '69 Midget

My god... What Dry boring read

I find that very odd comparing old journalism to modern journalism...back then colorful words where not respected ...it shod rsemmble the tax code book ...unlike today where even kim kardasions but has a color communtator

Prop
Prop and the Blackhole Midget

Larry

Did the Midget used in the test have an arb? It seems the factory let them out for test without them (being an option) which is a mistake. Triumph always provided all options on their test Spits, crucially the o/d.

A
Anthony Cutler

The R&T article may be dry by today´s journalistic standards, but I found it very interesting.

I note they say that "we learned that some cars can gain more from adjusted tire pressures than others. The Fiat, the MGB-GT, the MGB and the 914 gained the most." Many MGB owners will confirm that today.

I was very surprised to see how much the Midget rolls in the picture compared to the MGB, but I thought an anti roll bar was standard by 1973?

Tore
Tore

This thread was discussed between 29/12/2011 and 02/01/2012

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