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MG Midget and Sprite General - Another Strange One

A happy marriage between a Midget 1500 front end and a Sprite Mk3 rear...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120816857036
Dave O'Neill2

I am very interested in how that front crosmember looks....
Though the late style pedal box has me worryd the cut and shut line is in a critical place.....
Onno K

I would guess that the crossmember looks like a 1500, as the bumper reinforcements are also visible.
Dave O'Neill2

It does look like a 1500 in an early car. If not they've done a better job than most. The exhaust doesn't look like it's from a 1500. The interior of the boot looks funny - is that what you mean about the bumper reinforcements?
Daniel Thirteen-Twelve

Left side below the carbs you indeed can see the 1500 girder.
Good spot.
Exterior it indeed look good.
But an early rear and 1500 front can only mean bad things
Onno K

happy marriage Dave? Depending on where the join is they could be separated any time !
David Smith

Superficially looks loveley but so wrong with that engine in that body.
Gary & Gaps

<<Depending on where the join is they could be separated any time>>

My guess is just behind the A-panels, as it has light blue trim in the rear and navy in front.

<<so wrong with that engine in that body>>

Which body - Sprite or 1500 Midget?

At least it only has a single jacking point, so the rear half of the sill is Sprite.

I'm even more confused by the bracket for a boot lamp switch.
Dave O'Neill2

Come on then, take a stab.

How much is some idiot, oops sorry, spridget fan likely to bid for it? Will he get his £6000, or less than 2k?
Lawrence Slater

It's impossible to say what it will actually go for, but at £1979, it's already nearly £500 more than what I think it's worth.
Dave O'Neill2

Wow! That a proper Bitza. It indeed does have the 1500 front chassis extra bits but not in the boot. To get the grille to look right some of the front chassis strengtheners where the rubber bumper mounts, has to be cut back, which seems to have been done. It also has the early high light front wings which are correct for a '65. I thought the brake master cylinder on a 1500 had a bigger top than that, and a '65 has the tandem type. My '65 certainly doesn't have a bracket for a boot light switch either. Seats are '65, couldn't quite see the dashboard switches, but the indicator stalk is wrong for a '65. I wish it was a bit closer to me, I'd love to go and have a look and find out just where the join is.

Bernie.
b higginson

I'd go and 'alf inch his sprite grill.

Mine is a midget grill with bits taken off to make it look like a sprite grill. I'd buy a new one, but it seems you can't get the originals like that anyomre.
Lawrence Slater

I think it looks like a nice car!
This owner may not be knowledgeble enough to recognise the "differences" on his car and may have just bought it as a nice looking car.
Personaly I cannot be bothered by non original things on a car as long as it makes the owner happy with it.

The only worrying thing of this car to me is: how and what has been welded together to get this car as it is?
Is it just "old" panels that give the rear the old-look or a complete cut-in-half old-model body mated to each other?
Cut in half cars and then welded to another half are dangerous and even more when involved in a crash.

But again, I think the car looks great, very nice collor and a grunty engine too, could do with wider wheels in the rear arches tho to fill things up a little.
Arie de Best

3 miles from where I live, might be tempted to have a look to put my mind at rest.
It has to be a complete new 1500 front and original rear but where is it joined ?
Keep well away!
Rob Newt

Isn't it worrying that a "professional" valuation report didn't mention this? And still valued it at £6k?
Max max-at-midgetmax-dot-com

Agreed, a "Cut and Shut" done as a quick bodge job to deceive is highly dangerous. But what is the intrinsic difference between a well executed grafting of sound sub-assemblies, and the replacement of floor and sill panels to re-unite front and rear ends that many here have done (me included).
Guy

I once built a Nova Kit car which required a shortened Beetle chassis. I bought the chassis complete with gearbox fitted from the kit car company. I was very well done and perfectly safe, but I'd be really wary of this one unless I could see how it had been done. I'm sure that many of us on here would be able to spot a bad cut and shut, but some poor sucker who doesn't know the differences between the various models, might come along and be taken in by the reasonable appearance of the car and think that all Spridgets are the same and buy something that is potentially dangerous.
I, like Max, am surprised at the professional not mentioning the anomalies, but I suppose there are professionals and there are professionals. It could have been his brother or his dad.
I hope Rob does go and see it and report back.

Bernie.
b higginson

Well, it just goes to prove, that you shouldn't judge the teeth inside a horses mouth, without looking inside the cover of the book.

I rang the seller. Here's the story.

It was rebuilt for a guys 74 year old mum (previous owner). A triumph Spitifre lump was grafted in.

This guy, the present owner bought it, and has all the mots/bills, going back to when it was done. About 10 years plus ago.

No history before.

He paid 5K.

It has had several inspections and nobody has ever commented on it being two cars being married together.

The present owner, the seller, has never had this mentioned, and doesn't think it is two cars. Several potential buyers have seen it, and nobody has ever said this.

I am the first one to have asked him about it, and he was perplexed by my question.

He sounds like a genuine guy to me, but I haven't been face to face.

It won't sell for the price it's at now. If it doesn't get higher, he is probably going to pull it. There's no reserve on it, and he won't let it go for a song. He really wants circa 4K

So, here's a question for all of you.

How sure are you that it's two cars? I'm not convinced.

Me personally I wouldn't want a mk3 with a triumph lump in it, I prefer the A series. But otherwise I reckon it might actually be a nice car at the right price.
Lawrence Slater

Lawrence, it's not just the engine that's been grafted in...there was an awful lot of front-end bodywork attached to it, as well as the entire contents of the engine bay.

The inner wings, complete with reinforcements for the rubber bumpers; the footwell tops where the pedal box mounts; the heater tray.

I'm not even sure that the NSF wing isn't a 1500 which has been modified to take the earlier sidelight, as the curve of the wheelarch looks shallower...as per 1500.

If it weren't for the rear deck and B-posts being for the packaway hood, it would be easy to think that it was just a 1500 with the identity of a '65 car, but from the photos it is difficult to tell what the original shell was and which bits are from a different car.
Dave O'Neill2

the boot floor doesn't have the 'chassis leg' extensions to meeet up with the bumper mounts that the 1500 has, so along with the rear deck and B posts it really does look like an early back half and a 1500 front half.
David Smith

Well, as I've never worked on a 1500, I respect your opinions then.

But as far as the seller is concerned, it's not 2 cars, and I think if it's as obvious as you say, he wouldn't try and BullS't about it.

I think if he knew, he'd say. There's no point playing dumb when the evidence is that plain.

So it would seem that he didn't know, and wasn't told when he bought it.

So question is, how well has it been done.

10 plus years of use, and 10 years plus MOTs, would suggest that it must have been done pretty well.

It certainly hasn't come apart at the seams.


Lawrence Slater

Lawrence
It is a cut and shut.
That the owner does not know it does make it not in to one.
It just makes clear he bought the car wrongly informed (and at a way to high price)
And he has advertised the car to what he thinks it is.

Yes a cut and shut can be done properly and can have no ill effects.
But if it is not advertised properly I would walk away.
Onno K

if you buy a car privately then the seller may not be an expert on the car, model or make

same can be said of many specialist trade (official or not) dealers whether they admit it or not - this applies to valuers too

I don't think this guy sounds dodgy - unlike many in the car trade - he's put it's a Spitfire engine and has passed on the information he has about the car

if it's a cut and shut as said previously it's passed an inspection and a load of MOTs (whatever value you place on both) so it can't be that bad a job

Lawrence has talked to him and thinks the guy is genuine

face it most of our cars are to some extent at least kit/custom/altered/modified

I could well be proved wrong but just looking at the advert and photos this Spridget looks a lot better than many advertised (admittedly I look at very few adverts)

for me it's a nice colour, tidy looking, bits of paper history but after that it's the things I don't like but for a non-purist it could offer a good useable, or more-likely sunny Sunday and MOT only driven, car

like all cars for sale it requires a good test drive and close scrutiny of the car and paperwork but not dismissing out of hand at a price you’re prepared to pay
Nigel Atkins

This thread was discussed between 23/11/2011 and 26/11/2011

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