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MG Midget and Sprite General - 5-Speed conversion starts Monday!!

Following Sundays annual Gold Coast BCC show, I;m pulling the ribcase and replacing it w/ a Datsun 5-speed I've had for a few years.
I'm a little nervous, but I have time to do it now so here goes.

Phil Burke

Good lord Phil,

That looks great!

So how did you break it to the "Mrs." that you have been secretly hiding that little gem under the garage work bench behind some greasy boxes, Im sure married men want to know. LOL

Im guessing your using the datsun conversion kit from ... bellingtonmanslysonagy something something.. LOL

AKA ,,,Its not the rivergate kit, correct?

Definatly keep us posted with hourly updates, Im really intrerested in how this new kit comes togather and performs



Prop
Prop

I hope its BillM and the name you are butchering so nicely is billgariamotors.com
Rick Bastedo

I am useing Bill M's kit. He has aquired the Morris Service kits from Paul A. who has retired.
Bill had refined the design, and he is a real pleasure to deal with. I think rather than huge profits, his motivation is for all of us to have 5-speeds.
I'm figuring on a week or so, butI'll let you know how it progresses.
Phil 'B'
Phil Burke

"his motivation is for all of us to have 5-speeds"

Yes, that's my experience too.
Tomorrow I'm going with Bill to Vashon Island to help him drag yet another Datsun 210 back to his place.
If there's time left over maybe we will hook up my speedometer and right angle adapter.

I love my 5 speed, Bill rebuilt it. It's the Dogleg 60L model.
Rick Bastedo

Bill M?
Bill Mohan, our Bill Mohan??
Birmingham Bill?
He has a double life in the states?
His twin brother?
:)
Arie de Best

How does the dogleg work in "normal" life?
rachmacb

"how does the dogleg work in normal life?"

I am so tempted to write several different smartass responses to this, however I will stick to the most relevant and leave the rest to your imagination...

I drive the car every day, it has taken a little bit to get used to it coming from the 4 speed gearbox to this.

In case the casual reader is not aware Datsun provided a dogleg 5 speed for half a year in 1979. It's shift pattern goes like:
1st to the left and down
Reverse is straight up from 1st
2nd is up from 1st, a bit to the right then up
3rd is straight down from 2nd
4th is up to center then a tad to the right and up
5th is straight down from 4th

PaulA told me (as well as several Datsun enthusiasts agree) the dogleg is the stronger of the 60 series boxes.
It's sought after by racers as it can afford the skilled driver an edge in shifting times. As well as because it will theoretically take more abuse.

Real World? I find it to be a pleasure on the freeway.
When I want to remember the old gearbox I just shift up into 4th and there I am doing 4000 rpm at 70mph again. Then down into 5th and a nice civil 3200 rpm.
Along with my engine and dual 1.5 inch SU carbs and Datsun GX head on the Datsun A15 motor I find it pulls uphill just great. If I were to put my foot down I could easily accelerate up beyond what the police would consider to be 'safe and appropriate'.

I have found that driving in the dark is interesting as it turns out I am used to driving by engine sound rather than any input from gauges. This is because I can not keep the dash gauge lighting operational. One of those quirky things about my Midget. So I was driving at 4000 rpm in 5th gear the other morning and it struck me that I should check my speed. Good thing too, as there was a State Patrol car ahead and he would have been happy to try to balance the State budget on my wallet.

I've been growing more used to the shift pattern and the placement of the gears. It's really fun when I leave home and head for the freeway as there's an uphill drive to a two lane roundabout and usually someone in the other lane that seems amazed when I run around the thing in about 1/4 the time it takes them.
Rick Bastedo

Arie - that is Bill Masquelier of Renton Washington, USA
Rick Bastedo

Thanks Rick - for giving me a full answer - and avoiding the smart-ass comments that I probably deserved!
rachmacb

They make shift lights and shift gauges???....

Damn, Now I know what gauge I forgot in my 10 gauge consel

Back to the drawing board...Hahaha


Prop
Prop

BTW rick,

with your dogleg...

do you still use 1st gear vary often, or do you find your self using 2nd gear as your primary alt. 1st gear for regular in city street driving
Prop

Prop
I am BillM from Seattle-met you at LOTO!
The kit that Phil is using isn't the Morrisservice kit- it is a kit that I developed several years ago for my Sprite and have been selling ever since.
It is the conversion that I drove to LOTO (and back) from Seattle and works great.
Frank Claricci just put one in his daughter's Bugeye and seems to like it too!
Bill
Bill Masquelier

I always start out in 1st.
Probably just habit.
It's a good place to start on our Pacific Northwest mornings, haven't even given any thought to starting out in 2nd.
Rick Bastedo

Prop,
You're confusing the 1st gear in this the Datsun tranny with the granny gear of an older Chevy or Ford PU.

I'm useing Bill's kit with a standard shift pattern Datsun 210 tranny, standard a-series starter, datsun clutch.
Phil Burke

Bill Masquelier

Bill no offence is intended, I was trying to pull your name out of the back of my mind from memory...Ive seen your site about 3 times when I 1st became aware of it recently... its vary nice. Im just bad with names, Im better at remebering faces and objects... if its any conselation you are Infact the one I was thinking of. just wasnt able to pull the company name out... I knew it started with a "bell or a bill"

I know trevor jessie is a big fan... he is the one that told me of your new enterprise

any chance You may take on the ford type 9 also, I heard RUMORS that quantume mchanics may not continue selling that kit... another box that I remember someone from here on the BBS was devoloping was the BMW getreg 5 speed box, it was an interesting read and almost a sucess,,, but the clutch plate was hard to adapt...As common as those boxes are I always thought that was a good direction to persue.
Prop

Phil

sorry for the confusion

I was referancing ricks dogleg datsun... it has a differant shift pattern then the more common datsuns that we have

The dogleg set up is more for racing applications where 1st is more of a henderance then an advantage

heres a pic

Prop

Prop

Thanks Rick.
Arie de Best

Is there a web site for him?
WHU Underwood

http://www.billgariamotors.com
Rick Bastedo

http://billgariamotors.com/documents.htm
Trevor Jessie

I found it very useful to review the site and then contact Bill directly for guidence and pricing.

He told me that someone had just done the conversion keeping the Spridget starter and ring gear. They notched the Dtatsun tranny for the bendix, I'm going to try and drill an oval hole with a metal holesaw in mine.
Phil Burke

Phil, any updates?
Did you get started? Done already?

8-)
Rick Bastedo

Rick

I think phil is still playing with his hose


Ill get my coat... LOL
Prop

The motor is out, I've done all the prep on the tranny. I'm waiting on a new throw out/release bearing and new motor mount rubbers,
Hopefully, Saturday or Monday I'll be putting it all back in.
Pics to follow
Phil
Phil Burke

I know Im looking forward to the pics

BTW...are you getting a rear engine seal with the new conversion kit like what comes with the river gate kit?


At least now you have a few days to do all the engine bay clean up, painting, and detail work before the engine goes back in
Prop

It's Friday - how's the 5 speed install progressing?
Rick Bastedo

Progress is slow but steady.
The engine and tranny work is done
The clutch has been re-plumbed
The flywheel is mounted, however I buggered the pilot bushing, so I'm on hold till Monday when a replacement arrives

Th-th-thats all folks
Phil Burke

I have the Mini Mania seal kit. I don't know how much energy I can muster for the engine bay. A mild powerwash at least.


Phil Burke

One more of my chain hoist.
Sadly I installed it late at nite with the garage door down.
It needs to move abou 18" east
Fortunatly I'm only useing it to manhandle, and not actually installing the assy. I rent an a frame for that job.

Phil Burke

This thread was discussed between 18/02/2011 and 26/02/2011

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